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Why Produce Centavos?

Discussion in 'Banking - Investing - Finances' started by Rye83, Dec 12, 2015.

  1. Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Admin Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    Or perhaps more appropriately called "sentimo(s)" now? (Is this related to the Filipino vs Pilipino or standardizing the Filipino language thing? Don't know but seems the proper term is sentimo now.)
    Bangko Sentral ng Pilipinas - BSP Notes and Coins - Coins in Circulation

    Is there a benefit to having 1, 5 and 10 centavo coins? I would think the cost of making and transporting them would outweigh any economical benefits they produce. In 2014 it cost the US Mint 2.4 cents to make 1 penny. I wouldn't think the Bangko Sentral ng Pilipinas wouldn't have as efficient technology/techniques/machinery/skilled workers as the US Mint does. Leading me to believe it would cost the Philippines much more than 1 centavos to produce a 1 centavos coin.

    To put the value of these coins in perspective: a 1 centavo coin is barely worth the time it would take to pick it up off the ground.....even at Philippine day wages:
    • If you make P200 a day, then you make about 1 centavos every four seconds. The time spent finding and pulling them out of the cash register doesn't even cover the wages of the employee.
    • If you are a foreigner with a pension around $2k USD you are making almost 4 centavos every second.......by doing nothing. So would a 10 centavos coin that takes 2-3 seconds to pick up (or maybe even a 1 peso coin for some of you older guys that might take some extra time bending over) be worth the time it took to pick it up for you?
    The time it takes to pull some of these coins out of your pocket and find it among the other coins is worth more than the coin itself.

    It seems that the only purpose the coins really serve is to allow large corporations/gas stations to "earn" a bit of extra profit and to make their products look cheaper than they actually are: an item that is 999.99 pesos is really 1,000 pesos as the cashiers rarely has any 1 centavos coins to give out as change. Same thing applies to gas stations: they round out the change....usually in their favor). Though any extra profit they made on the coins is quickly lost by simply transporting them to a bank. Unless my math is way off here, it seems these things do nothing but cost the Philippines money. (Of course it is very possible my math is completely crap and all this is total nonsense.)

    Maybe corruption and/or lies has something to do with why they still exist? Which is a big reason the US still produces pennies:
    :banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead:
    (Side comment: The difference between bribery and lobbying is purely semantics: with bribery you paid a politician to listen to your sales pitch and expect the money to influence them. With lobbying you claim not to expect anything in return for the money....you're just paying a politician to hear your sales pitch. :meh: But any fool could figure out that if you don't vote the way a person/corporation paid you to vote that money will very likely not be there the next time around....lobbying most definitely is quid pro quo and most people can see that it is a form of corruption.)

    US and Philippines politics might not compare but it certainly raises the question of who is winning the contract to supply the raw material and if any politicians might be profiting from making these worthless, and largely unused, coins. My 2 cents. (pun intended :wink:)
     
  2. RR_biker

    RR_biker DI Senior Member Veteran Marines

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    When the euro was introduced on January 1, 2002. there were coins of 1, 2, 5, 10, 20, 50, 100 and 200 cents.
    Finland was the first country not to introduce the 1 and 2 euro cent coin, for reason explained above.
    Soon shops, supermarket in other countries started to round up prices to a equivalent of 5.
    Nowadays hardly nobody is using these 2 coins and some shops even refuse them.
    Why in the Phils these coins of 1, 5 and 10 centavos are still being used; I have no idea.
    I only know that in the event I get change (and not enough coins available) it will be always me who has to accept it.
    In the beginning I did not care but when I noticed that in the event I paid for the bill but for instance 5 centavos lacking, it was insisted I should also give the lacking 5 centavos.
    Funny situation than sometimes existed I was waiting for my change in coins not available.
    It's not a matter of 1, 5, 10 or more centavos, it's just the idea that, specially foreigners, have to accept this kind of situation.
     
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  3. Jack Peterson

    Jack Peterson DI Forum Luminary Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Air Force

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    Try Paying for something with these silly Coins
     
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    Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Admin Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    I've never been in possession of enough of them at one time to buy anything only those coins. I'm sure the cashier wouldn't be too thrilled about counting all of it.
     
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  5. charlyB

    charlyB DI Senior Member

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    The ones with the holes make good washers and also cheaper than buying washers in handyman :jawdrop:
     
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  6. DaveD

    DaveD DI Senior Member Showcase Reviewer Veteran Navy

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    I agree with your thought process and summary. In my personal experience the first time I ever saw the 5 or 10 centavo (sentivo?) coins was at SM in Clark (in central Luzon shortly after they opened maybe 8 years ago??? maybe little longer my memory is not that precise) Prior to seeing them in SM Clark I had never seen nor used anything below a 25 centavo coin since the mid 1990's when I moved here. I believe they were brought back because large corporations like SM lobbied (bribed policy makers) to bring them back because over all their outlets those 5 an 10 centavo coins added up to 1000's of Piso more profit for the corporation. Remember they don't give a d*mn about anyone but themselves and their bottom line. With the small amount of wages they pay (slave wages on temp employees mainly as very few full time employees at their malls) some bean counter probably came up with this scheme and maybe the angle of a relative sold the raw materials or owned the mints probably played into the decision to use them. For what it's worth IMPO
     
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  7. KINGCOLE

    KINGCOLE DI Senior Member Highly Rated Poster

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    I remember many years ago, when change was sparse. In those days, your small change was given as a chewing gum or a sweet. The value of the metal was worth more than the value of the coin, so people were melting them down.
     
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    Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Admin Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    Melting them down would only be worth it if the coins were donated and you had a whole lot of them (several kilograms worth). The labor, energy need to melt and remove impurities from the coins and transportation to a buyer would make it a net loss. If you had enough coins to come up with a significant amount of metal to sell you would be better off lugging them to a bank to trade in for pesos.
     
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  9. KINGCOLE

    KINGCOLE DI Senior Member Highly Rated Poster

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    Ever imagine where P1 coins are going? | News Feature, News, The Philippine Star | philstar.com
    Taiwanese arrested in Manila smuggling raid - Taipei Times
     
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    Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Admin Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    Concerning smugglers:
    I think the public is telling them everything they need to know. The coins are completely worthless and/or too big of a hassle to carry around in their pockets.
    Hint: If the coins are only useful to smugglers who can get the coins out of country in quantities that fill up shipping containers to have them melted down (and the public refuses to use them) then you might be producing a coin that you don't need to produce.

    Hopefully one of those "angles" is convincing lawmakers how much the they are wasting on having them produced.
     
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