Degree vs Experience

I think I get it. They are avoiding high risk practices, which results in degree requirements by the company (not necessarily the government). Even if this isn't a "thing" in the U.S. - it still builds a case for pursuing a degree for Europeans.

I would further add that having to work abroad also furthers this case. Company X may not require a degree, but that degree still might be required by the country which issues the visa.

This answers my question about the relevance of "exempt status" to this thread.

In my defense, the context has shifted though. My original track may have been different if the "son" wasn't a US citizen (though that's still an assumption) or if the subject was Filipino.

 

The reason he doesn't see it is because it's not a "thing" in the US. IBM, HP, etc may hire differently in Europe. The other side of the pond has all sorts of labor laws which we consider strange. And Europe thinks the US is strange for not having those laws.

If you are looking at a developer job from Amazon, Google, Microsoft, Apple, etc then exempt status isn't a thing because those jobs are likely over the threshold. Though these companies also may not pay as well in Europe.

 

Okay, I was kind of with you there for a bit, but now you've jumped the shark.

I can now see the difference in our thinking.

Professional is another of those tricky words because it can mean so many different things.

For me, the term is about protocols. The professional relationship sets expectations and a basic rule set which helps each side of a relationship "plug in" to conduct transactions to trade goods and services. It's an attempt at standardization. Dance moves. I work by this definition as a solo software developer.

The term can also be signaling for an economic class and the values which go along with that class. If you believe this way about professionalism, then you probably believe the same about being a card carrying college graduate.

This is the pivot point of our disagreements. You have asked several times in this thread why I don't "see" but now I know that's because I don't see the same striations of economic status. I could give a rat's a$$ who you are or where you came from. I only care about what you can actually do. I don't give a rat's a$$ what people think about coders relative to scientists, I only care about how useful software is in application to the problems I come up against.

Maybe this is all just a joke and you are busting my balls. In that case, you got me because I have been replying all along.

To the question of degree vs experience, we didn't even get to the heart of it. Your choice of school should take into account the quality of the program and the people who you will be learning under. What is Silliman's strongest program? Does the school have world class brains? That's the what and the where to studying at Silliman. If it's not something you are interested in, then look elsewhere.

Young people today are best served by with travel and experience to the center of gravity of whatever they are interested in. If you are interested in working in the restaurant industry, then go work and study in Spain where there's the highest concentration of world best restaurants. If you are interested in the software industry, then go to SF. If you are interested in finance, then Wall Street, London or any other world class financial center.

Wherever you go, make that proverbial first buck on day one by getting into the trenches. If you aren't doing that, then you are just playing some other game and it doesn't matter what you are doing. The practice of BS can be pursued anywhere. The Philippines is particularity strong with BS, so Silliman would be a perfect location in that case.

Seriously? These jobs say right on the tin "Requires a Computer Science degree or equivalent experience."

 

Computer Science is a STEM degree which requires at least the lowest common denominator of science / engineering degrees. I believe this is the degree which is usually mentioned as a requirement sans experience.

There are some universities which offer non-STEM "technology" degrees. These are CIS (computer information systems) and usually get stuffed into the business department.

The consensus from what I come across regarding degree requirements is that you need the degree if your job is going to look like research (doing science-y stuff.) In this case, an undergrad degree isn't enough. You need to be packing a graduate degree or a reputation. This is the sort of requirement you'll see in the frontiers where companies are burning through investment dollars on product research which could hit a dead-end. Think AI, VR/AR, driver-less cars, robotics, etc.

Of the massive numbers of jobs which Google and Amazon recently announced, most of those are likely for people writing code. This isn't the same gig as it has been in the past. You have to move fast to keep up these days. The stacks we work with are a house of cards which isn't easy to keep upright.

I imagine hardware people are getting paid in the same ballpark as software people. I prefer software because it's more convenient to open a terminal and bang out some code. I can do that from anywhere as long as I have an internet connection. I can then deploy / ship that code as a polished product to real users from the same terminal and the same remote location.