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Noreco again!

Discussion in 'Expat Section' started by barryrio, Jan 12, 2021.

  1. Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Admin Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    Do you honestly think that is the case?
     
  2. Senjenbing

    Senjenbing DI Forum Adept Veteran Marines Navy

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    i can only assume that some Noreco employee was flicking or unflicking the wrong switch, if that is the case

    One of the problems that NORECO/NGCP have is the age of their control system(s). When there is a need to switch providers the supplies have to be synchronised before it can be switched over. (Synchronisation of the line frequency in Hz to within predefined limits). If they do not have automatic synchronisation equipment then it needs to be done manually which can be time consuming and a little hit & miss depending on the experience of the operative. If they don't hit the synchronisation and try to switch the system will trip - resulting in a power transmission failure. This only takes minutes to reset - i.e. flick a switch - hence the occasional short power outage.
     
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  3. jimeve

    jimeve DI Forum Luminary Highly Rated Poster Showcase Reviewer Veteran Army

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    They must have done it again last night. Brownout. 9: 00 pm to 10:30 pm.
     
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  4. Philpots

    Philpots DI Senior Member Restricted Account

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    Well I think that was a fault somewhere. A synchronization switch problem would not cause an hour and a half outage. You only to have a look at the power poles to see how well these things are engineered and lord knows when proper maintenance is performed on the main grid. Wait till it breaks seems to be the rule here and that applies to just about everything including vehicles big or small. All quite normal for a third world country.
     
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    barryrio

    barryrio DI Member

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    Here we go again! Into our second brownout tonight (Sunday). Who will Noreco pass the buck to this time lol!
     
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  6. Philpots

    Philpots DI Senior Member Restricted Account

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    Look n the bright side of life, as Brian would say! While the power is off you are saving on your power bill! Lol.
     
  7. charlyB

    charlyB DI Senior Member

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    Ours went off around 9.30pm, came back for about 2 seconds at 9.45pm ( that's the real appliance killer :arghh:) then fully back around 11.30pm.
     
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  8. djfinn6230

    djfinn6230 DI Senior Member

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    You are very correct about the appliance killer comment. Sensitive electronics do not handle repeated power line disturbances (PLD) very well although some higher quality appliances are designed more expensively do handle occasional PLD. Most common ones such as PC’s and TVs especially mfrd in China eventually get destroyed. For that reason I use UPS’s to keep the power up temporarily to shut down manually when brownouts occur. I also connect my modem router to them to keep up the internet. UPS are available from Lazada from companies like INTEX.

    I did not know about the power line sync issue but if NORECO does not have a zero cross switch switch to sync the frequencies, wow, connecting them 180 degrees out of phase would burn up a lot of transformers and other distribution equipment. Hit and miss. Amazing.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  9. Philpots

    Philpots DI Senior Member Restricted Account

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    Im sure its not hit and miss, synching with an oscilloscope would do the trick quite well.
     
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  10. Notmyrealname

    Notmyrealname DI Forum Luminary Highly Rated Poster Showcase Reviewer

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    You are obviously very technically skilled, so what is your opinion of this article I just read? Currently (excuse pun!) I am using only surge protectors connected to most power sockets and need to think about UPS:

    (https://switchon.eaton.com/plug/article/176/ups-vs.-surge-suppressor#)

    "The fact is that neither UPS nor surge protection devices (SPD) alone will provide complete protection for commercial systems. The most effective installation is ensured by utilizing a combination of both forms of power conditioning.

    Surge protectors (or suppressors) provide just that: a line of defense against surges, which are short-term high voltages above 110 percent of nominal. They are often associated with lightning strikes and utility switching, but in fact 80% of surges originate inside a facility. These occur due to electrical switching or other disturbances created by various devices within the building. Regardless of the source, the increased voltage from surges can damage the components of electrical systems such as computers, networks, and process control equipment.

    Even if nothing is immediately destroyed, over time the increased strain can cause premature failure of expensive components. It’s important to note that surge protection will not keep your equipment operational during a blackout, but damaging surges occur much more frequently than power outages. A properly designed backup power system should always incorporate a cascaded approach to applying surge protection (i.e. a two layered approach) working in conjunction with a UPS. The first surge unit, (upstream SPD) mitigates the brunt of the surge energy while the second unit (the UPS) reduces any remaining surge energy to an inconsequential level.

    A UPS delivers second-level protection against surges; it should never be considered a primary surge protection device. It also continually regulates incoming voltage and provides an internal battery that allows connected equipment to continue running even if the power supply is cut. In order for your electronic devices to continue to function even if power is unavailable, you need a UPS, and often a backup generator.

    So how do you apply these devices coherently? Surge protection should be installed on the utility side of your UPS, ideally on the bypass line. This provides the following modes of protection:

    a. Greatly extends the life of the surge protection components in your UPS
    b. Provides surge protection for your load when the UPS is off line for maintenance

    Surge protection installed on the utility side of a UPS will also help protect the UPS. A dramatic surge event, such as a lightning strike can be associated with over 20KV and 5kA. The typical let through voltage of a surge device (UPS included) when subjected to this level of surge event would be roughly 2000V, which is still high enough to cause equipment damage. To eliminate this we install an upstream unit and allow the UPS to mitigate the effects of the remaining surge energy, i.e. driving the final let through voltage down to around 200V which is well below the point that would cause damage.

    Additionally, it may be wise to install an SPD between the UPS output and the load distribution system. This is especially true if the load panel is located a long distance from the UPS. The more distance, the better likelihood that an internally generated surge could impact the load.

    So which form of power protection is best suited for your environment? The answer is, both. Critical servers, workstations, PCs, POS and VoIP equipment, and other key business devices are protected by attaching a UPS, ensuring they are able to function in the event of a power outage and, if needed, shut down cleanly if power remains out for an extended period of time. Surge devices are required as well, to protect both critical equipment, and even the UPS itself."

    Do you have any clarifications or additional advice to add to what (another pun!) is written above for use in the home (almost yet another pun - and no off-topics!)?
     
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