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Breakthrough Covid

Discussion in 'COVID-19' started by PatO, Aug 24, 2021.

  1. Show Pony

    Show Pony DI Forum Patron Highly Rated Poster Showcase Reviewer

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    You managed to confuse yourself.
    CONGRATULATIONS.
    Edit.
    Whatever point you were trying to make was based on defective information.
    You go on and on about people have the right to make their own choices wether to get vaccinated or not. People should make their own decisions. The chance of making a correct decision depends on having correct information.
     
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    Last edited: Sep 8, 2021
  2. eskirvin

    eskirvin DI Forum Adept Blood Donor Veteran Navy

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    I'm not at all confused. I even further explained to you by making up completely false examples. I don't know how you could have missed that the data didn't matter in addition to not being my data.

    I do go on about people making their own choice on "whether" or not to get vaccinated, that's true. People should make their own decisions, that is also true.

    Making a correct decision based off of correct information is not something most people do. They make decisions based off of feelings, which is something people should have the right to do. Information of course plays a part. Many people do check the "weather" before deciding "whether" or not to carry an umbrella.
     
  3. Senjenbing

    Senjenbing DI Member Veteran Marines Navy

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    Proven - therefore I rest my case! :laugh:
     
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  4. eskirvin

    eskirvin DI Forum Adept Blood Donor Veteran Navy

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    You should rest. This is hard for you. I hope the rest helps.
     
  5. eskirvin

    eskirvin DI Forum Adept Blood Donor Veteran Navy

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    Yes, but not social justice, clearly.
     
  6. Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Admin Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    I think it is social justice. You have your freedoms but private entities and individuals (society) is telling them their behavior and beliefs aren't welcome. Society is dishing out what they feel is just. Social justice isn't just a liberal thing. Conservatives do the exact same thing. Example: Texas and their new abortion and voting laws. They are pushing what they feel is morally just on the minority.

    Social justice has been practiced for all of human existence. It isn't some new liberal agenda like Fox would like everyone to believe. If it weren't for the Bill of Rights we would likely be living under a Christian theocracy where "social justice" and the bible would be the law of the land and everyone would need to follow some self serving interpretation of scripture or risk being "cancelled" with actual freedoms lost through imprisonment or through more permanent measures.
     
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  7. eskirvin

    eskirvin DI Forum Adept Blood Donor Veteran Navy

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    What I meant by that, is that there are no trials for social justice, just judgement. The rest, I agree with.
     
  8. Toto

    Toto DI Senior Member

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    No, it isn't. You actually think that Long Covid shouldn't be taken into account and dismiss it? Your commentary seems to only address what you perceive as her method. Anyone who puts out numbers as a basis for determination of risk has to account for known risks. Hers was just an example. There are many examples, but for adults 10% of the hospitalizations is a fairly widely used figure. Long Covid should give anyone pause.
     
  9. Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Admin Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    No there isn't. If someone is a racist POS and expresses that publicly they should expect immediate consequences from their peers, employers and society. There are consequences for our actions. No judge or jury is required for punishment from our communities. "Freedom" does not equal freedom from consequence. You have the freedom to be a complete @ss and society has the right to fire you and tell you to f*ck off for being a tw@t.

    I think hospitals that are nearing capacity should be turning away or kicking covid patients out of bed for those that have been offered an FDA approved vaccine and refused it. Let them die on the steps of the hospital. Eventually we will run out of people that are stupid enough to believe these are crisis actors. The same way they don't prioritize alcoholics for liver transplants.
     
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  10. Toto

    Toto DI Senior Member

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    But it isn't just them they affect. Society has interests, and by that I mean everyone but that individual. If that person masks with an N95 and is careful, I understand them as they are thinking of others beyond them. We allow people to be stupid ( a subjective term). But if they aren't careful and considerate of others, then they increase the risk of harm and death to others. There is no right to increase the risk of harm and death to others. No right.
    So a month ago in a conversation with a reporter, a CDC person said there were 750 deaths associated with the vaccine, and 142 of them had been investigated and found not to be due to the vaccine, so that's 608 deaths. The population of the US is 332 million and say 30% were under 18 or can't be vaxxed, that leaves 232.5 million. That leaves you with .0000026 chance or .00026% chance of death. You don't get to consider complications because you dismissed the complications of long covid. Society has interests -
    1. Replication - more replication increases the chance of more transmissible and/or more virulent variants.
    2. Transmission - less transmission, the numbers in 3. say you will transmit less if vaxxed.
    3. Straining the Health System - Cloggin up the hospitals and morgues with your body and carcass. Straining the hospital systems and ICUs produces poorer care, more deaths, and leads to triage. The unvaccinated are 5x more likely to get infected and 29 times more likely to be hospitalized.
    4. Long Covid - this adds an additional burden to the health system during a pandemic and beyond. Kids are infected more with Delta. I do not know how triage is practiced, but I do know Oklahoma was transferring kids to Texas when their system was overwhelmed. The next generation will deal with that.
    OK, feel free to dismiss it all, or denigrate it as you want.
     
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