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Vehicles & Servicing Best Posts in Thread: Buying a Used Motorcycle

  1. Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Admin Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    This is why, now more than ever, it is important to make sure all documents are in perfect order. Getting clean documents transferred is headache enough given the current pandemic, any deviance from perfection will only turn the normal headache into a debilitating and soul crushing migraine.

    As for new vehicles; for some reason cars seem to be treated differently than motorcycles. When I bought a new motorcycle, around March 2020, no temporary plates were given (only a "for registration" plate...which fell off around 2 months ago) and I was given a short letter saying when it was purchased and that registration was pending, nothing saying I was allowed to drive it. No idea if this would do any good at a checkpoint...I just assume it doesn't really matter since I'm driving around with absolutely no plate on the rear and nobody has said anything or even asked for the documents at a checkpoint. Whereas the new car, purchased around a month ago, has orange LTO inspection stickers on the front and back windows, plates with numbers on it and a much more official sounding letter saying I'm authorized to drive until permanent plates and the registration are issued. Does this actually give me the right to drive it? No idea...but it gives me a warm fuzzy.

    If I was ever asked about plates or registration at a checkpoint I would just say, "sorry sir, out of stock". It always worked and got a laugh from the person asking for the sticker requirements before, I assume it may work now. If one of my vehicles ever got impounded I would likely hire a lawyer and file a case against the LTO/police and plead my case to a judge and hope for the best. I just consider this nonsense as par for the course in the Philippines and go with the flow, complaining will do nothing.
     
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    Last edited: Jul 21, 2020
    Rye83, Jul 21, 2020
    #5
  2. NowandThen

    NowandThen DI Forum Adept Restricted Account

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    I bought my bike over 2 years ago and now I don't even bother anymore to ask the LTO when my number plates will be available. I went to a shop and bought a plastic number plate (looks even good). The bike is registered, smoke test done. End of the story.

    Gesendet von meinem SM-N950F mit Tapatalk
     
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    NowandThen, Jul 21, 2020
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  3. SkipJack

    SkipJack DI Senior Member

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    The situation here in the province is confused. The overarching goal is to prevent vehicle theft. Technology has helped the LTO immensely but because of privacy rules it does not help the unsuspecting buyer.

    There are two processes. 1) The new network database technology and 2) the old paperwork process.

    1) The new network database technology works to protect the LTO.
    Thanks to modern technology, the authorities and the LTO have a database of chassis, engine and license plate numbers. A past registered owner can report the vehicle as stolen. The authorities then place an "alarm" in the database associated with the vehicle id, engine number and license plate. The authorities then can track down any subsequent person who tries to register or has already registered the vehicle.

    As part of this new technology there is a user interface that the public can use.

    from any mobile network, text LTO VEHICLE and then the license plate of the vehicle to 2600 during LTO business hours and it will respond with a listing of any alarms raised against the vehicle. this way you know that currently there are no reports of theft against that license plate number and the engine and chassis numbers associated with it.

    Example, assuming the license plate is ABC 123 then text
    LTO VEHICLE ABC123 to 2600
    Note the space between the letters and numbers in the license plate has been removed.

    2) The paperwork process serves to protect the buyer from buying a stolen vehicle.
    The thief does not care if the buyer can register the vehicle. The thief only wants their money. The way to do this is to obfuscate the origination of the vehicle. This is done through intermediaries and can be expedited with an "open deed of sale". The problem is that this "open deed of sale" is also used by people acting as dealers to flip cars. They buy cheap and sell it soon for more. The "flippers" want to avoid the additional cost of registering the car to themselves.
    The open deed of sale has also become popular with people in the province who do not have the time and money to travel to the LTO office to register the car. They simply keep the open deed of sale and continue to pay the registration fees of the previous owner.
    The problem is that only using the open deed of sale leaves no evidence that the intermediary was involved in the sale. So the buyer has no recourse against the actual seller.

    IN SUMMARY
    If you are interested in purchasing a used car from an individual do the following:

    BEFORE YOU BUY THE VEHICLE !
    1) Text the licence plate number to the LTO service at 2600:
    LTO VEHICLE ABC123
    This will tell you if there is an alarm on the vehicle.

    2) Take the vehicle to the smog test place and have them create tracings of the chassis and engine numbers. Make sure these agree with the numbers shown on the original Certificate of Registration. This helps to ensure that the vehicle has the proper license plate.

    3) Make sure you get a notarized deed of sale from the person selling you the vehicle and a copy of two government issued ids with three signatures on each copy. (The person who will be taking your money.) This is a legal record through which you can hold them accountable if there are problems later. (encumbrances, theft, etc.)

    4) I advise against this. If you are buying a vehicle under an open deed of sale, then have this second deed of sale notarized etc. Make sure you have copies of two pieces of government issued identification of the original seller and the current seller. So you will have two deeds of sale from two sellers. The original and the current. This way you have evidence of the person who actually sold you the vehicle.
     
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    SkipJack, Jul 13, 2021
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  4. Show Pony

    Show Pony DI Forum Patron Highly Rated Poster Showcase Reviewer

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    I was in at the new smoke test in Banilad today and spoke to Smoke Test Ernie. He said to renew an overdue OR you should have a copy of the last valid OR and a copy of the CR to bring the OR up to date. There is no need to involve the registered owner. He said there will be some penalties for being late renewing the OR (not sure the cost).
    Once the OR is brought up to date it is straight forward to transfer the CR.
    Note: you need a photocopy of the sellers ID and a notarized Absolute Deed of Sale and the original CR.

    The new smoke test in Banilad charges the same prices as all the other places in town. They have a nice airconditioned lounge to wait while your vehicle gets tested.
    The wait time was short as they don't have many customers. People seem to think the new place is fancy so it must be expensive, which it is not.
     
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    Show Pony, Jul 12, 2021
    #15
  5. Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Admin Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    Make sure papers are under the sellers name. If the registration hasn't been transferred into the sellers name (they have a deed of sale for the vehicle but the OR/CR is still in the previous owners name) just walk away from it...especially during this pandemic when owners may be on different islands/provinces and are not available to show in person to have a deed of sale notarized. (Notarization is a requirement and lawyers are becoming much more strict on the showing in person part of that.) Also avoid blank "open deeds of sale". These should never be trusted as it ripe for abuse and scams.

    Make sure the OR/CR do not have a lien/encumbrance on it. If it does that opens a whole new can of worms that involves banks, 3rd parties and government offices.

    Original OR/CR. Information regarding the sale (price, addresses of both parties, etc) Both parties show in person to sign with a valid government ID. (Foreign passports and driver's licenses will work.) Photocopies of IDs and 3 sample signatures on those copies. Any respectable attorney/notary will make sure everything is in line.

    Once you purchase you will need to transfer the OR/CR into your name at the LTO. Do this ASAP, if the previous owner loses a court case and doesn't pay the settlement all their assets can be frozen and you will not be able to transfer until they pay up and the freeze is lifted, you may even be ordered to turn the vehicle over...even if you purchased the vehicle years before the case was lost and the assets were frozen (this happened to me). If the registration is still valid you shouldn't need to pay for the LTO provided insurance again (not sure on this one). I have yet to find an insurance company that will provide full/comprehensive coverage on motorcycles but if the bike does happen to have that you should contact that insurance company to speak about the transfer of coverage.

    Whenever the OR/CR needs to be renewed you will need to do a smoke test. It is a prerequisite for registration. The age of the bike does not play a part in this.
     
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    Last edited: Jul 21, 2020
    Rye83, Jul 21, 2020
    #2
  6. Happy Camper

    Happy Camper DI Senior Member Restricted Account Infamous Showcase Reviewer

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    Here's a hint. If purchasing a used vehicle ask to see the registration, if it isn't registered in this jurisdiction, walk away and tell them to call you when it is properly registered here.
     
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    Happy Camper, Sep 9, 2020
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  7. Philpots

    Philpots DI Senior Member Restricted Account

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    Yup did that for my son who bought a new bike. Simply showed the docs I had to the guy who makes plates and bingo, Plates, nice ones, Well worth the few pesos.
     
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    Philpots, Jul 22, 2020
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  8. DavyL200

    DavyL200 DI Forum Luminary ★ Global Mod ★ ★ Moderator ★ Highly Rated Poster Showcase Reviewer

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    And as of now im still waiting on the registration of my bike,its been one month now due to the lto only doing 200 a day.
     
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    DavyL200, Jul 21, 2020
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  9. Always a Poppy

    Always a Poppy DI Senior Member Restricted Account

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    Thanks Rye. Very helpful.
     
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    Always a Poppy, Jul 21, 2020
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  10. Notmyrealname

    Notmyrealname DI Forum Luminary Highly Rated Poster Showcase Reviewer

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    Can you use it in the meantime? In early 2017 my wife cancelled a new car purchase because she was informed by the main dealer she should not drive it without registration and that such reg would take 6 months!
     
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    Notmyrealname, Jul 21, 2020
    #4