Best Posts in Thread: Chinese Vaccine

Brazil has been testing CoronaVac (the vaccine made by Sinovac) and it is reported that only about 50% of the vaccinated people are protected.

Now it is reported that there is a new variant of the virus in Brazil.

It has been written previously on this Forum about the possibility of natural selection allowing new variants to emerge through vaccination - so would 'incomplete' vaccination be a greater problem by killing off only weaker strains (as in incomplete use of antibiotics)?

Without being alarmist, there is a very strong case for people protecting themselves and their close ones as this could be a very long haul and only efficient personal protection gives an almost 100% chance of survival - relying on vaccines may not work and may make things even worst and people too complacent.

PROTECT YOURSELF and your close ones.

 

Well you know, John Moore from Cornell University does not live in UK and is not completely familiar with the technical details leading up to the UK decision. If I have learned anything from this pandemic it is that advice from professors and bureaucrats, who have no skin in the game. is free as long as they can see their name in a major publication like the NYT. I tend to look at the UK NHS as an organization that at the least will not unnecessarily and gravely risk the lives of UK citizens in these matters; they are probably looking at risk vs benefit in terms of the population.


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It is always so difficult to understand the real motives of politicians - some really do want to serve the people (yes, really, some do!) but so many are grabbing, self-interested scum.

So some will take the vaccine to help others accept it (although I would never put in my body what some politicians do!) and others just want to be protected and will willingly take the queue ahead of a more needy person.

Get a real disaster (i.e. asteroid or nuke war) and they will be closeted in bunkers (along with Royals) whilst the ordinary folk perish. When/if they all come out, what a cr*p set of genes we will have available to restart the population!

 

Well, there is this: "The good thing about the mRNA vaccine is that if you prime with it, you can boost with other types of vaccines (viral vectored, DNA, mRNA…etc). In the future, a mixed prime boost vaccine strategies can be tested to provide long term protective immunity."
— Prof. Akiko Iwasaki, Yale immunologist (@VirusesImmunity) January 1, 2021

 

Wish I can send that edited video of that old lady getting vaccinated then became that old lady demon from 'Legion' in here. That would be hilarious. Ha. But I nominate all the politicians to be vaccinated first! Might as well since they have always enjoyed the privilege to get things first than common people (i.e. testing kits when they were initially introduced)

 

I recently read an interesting article about how such an mRNA vaccine actually works: https://berthub.eu/articles/posts/reverse-engineering-source-code-of-the-biontech-pfizer-vaccine/

Quite fascinating stuff and a considerable technological advancement over how traditional vaccines are made. I’d take that over a Chinese made vaccine any time.

Also it appears that all vaccines the EU is currently acquiring (mRNA or not) are way cheaper than what the Chinese ask for theirs (all less than EUR 20 per dose, some considerably so):

https://www.hln.be/binnenland/zovee...rijzen-per-ongeluk-online~a3dceef4/180355293/

 

My thinking is that for vaccine to be really safe. it should be:
1. Produced by an independent company with no links to any government which might put pressure on it. Tricky one, as there is pressure on everyone over a suitable vaccine.
2. Be tested on enough people of various groups.
3. Be tested for long enough to see any side effects (that can never be fully ruled out as side effects could theoretically appear decades later).

I would also look at how the vaccine was produced:
1. Using mRNA - I read an article this morning dismissing the myth of the mRNA in a vaccine combining with a person's DNA - but they are not the same thing! Is it possible the mRNA of the vaccine could mix with mRNA of the vaccinated person? Just a thought.
2. Using a weakened (attenuated) version of the virus - the safety issue here is whether the virus has been weakened enough and the risk from bad batches ('bad batches' could be the case with every form of vaccine).
3. Using a killed version of the virus - where '2' applies again.
4. Using similar viruses - probably safe if known over a period of time not to produce illness in humans BUT the risk is a recombination with the actual virus. How would that pan out? Could it produce a new virus able to spread even more rapidly.
4. Using a piece of the protein coat - this would be my vaccine of choice, all other issues being equal.

Then there is the issue of the growing medium and the adjuvant:
The growing medium is what was used to grow the virus to produce the vaccine. There are established cell lines, such as Vero and HeLa, but sometimes chicken embryos are used. An adjuvant is a substance added to the vaccine to enhance its effect - to boost the immune response. Some adjuvants produce side effects, but should not be enough to cause serious harm. These issues should be taken care of by the testing process of the whole vaccine - so we come back to the main question: Have the vaccines been tested for long enough in enough different groups of people. Time will tell. It is now down to individual choice on this issue, throwing in the societal benefit for those interested in society.

 

This was taken out of context in the original article.

The minimum requirements for approval was 50%. The Sinovac vaccine far exceeded this.

Although the final results are not finished. The Sinovac vaccine appears to be in the area of 80%- 90% effective.

Turkey reports 91.25%

https://www.scmp.com/news/world/mid...urkey-says-chinas-coronavac-vaccine-9125-cent

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...icacy-uncertain-despite-brazil-turkey-results

Sinovac is price gouging. Their price is a form of high-way robbery. They are even selling it in China for the high price. One would think that a socialist/communist government would resist this.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-china-vaccine-idUSKBN2710UQ

https://www.ft.com/content/80f20d71-d7eb-4386-b0f2-0b19e4aed94d

It is one of the highest priced vaccines being made available to the Philippines:
https://newsinfo.inquirer.net/1372054/explainer-facts-about-7-covid-19-vaccines-philippines-may-get

 

https://news.abs-cbn.com/overseas/12/12/20/peru-suspends-clinical-trials-of-chinese-covid-19-vaccine?fbclid=IwAR1XPkW_4bMriyja9DCV77ND0QgVrn4Nz0fd_Ca1oyXgSZBj0VoHfFbAkMY