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Suggestion Foreigners and Expats, Economic progress think tank. Outside the box!

Discussion in 'Expat Section' started by Crystalhead, Apr 7, 2020.

  1. djfinn6230

    djfinn6230 DI Senior Member

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    Ah yes, another idea. Implement “Title Insurance” so that when relatives of the seller come out of the woodwork making ridiculous claims that they have ownership of the land via some extrajudicial settlement that was notarized by an attorney, and never recorded on the title, and sympathetic judges who favor nationals allow the claim, you are insured for the loss. Buying property here is very risky for newcomers. It is a risk many foreigners don’t want to take. This type of reform must accompany any allowance for foreigners to own small parcels of land, and if not, at least for Filipino spouses to purchase such property. Also, speed up the issuance of titles by at least 1 year.


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  2. Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    Seems that this thread is more about, or turning into, making life easier for foreigners, not about making life better for the average Filipino. To be expected I guess, if the Philippines turned into a Japan, Korea or Singapore most foreigners here would be forced to find a cheaper place to live. That's fine but let's not disguise looking out for one's own wellbeing as something else.
     
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  3. djfinn6230

    djfinn6230 DI Senior Member

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    Not allowing foreign ownership of land, or making it difficult to purchase, and not allowing 51% ownership of businesses is a major factor holding back development of this country. If the Philippines turned into one of those developed countries you mentioned, then for the purposes of this thread, this exercise would be a “success”. Nobody is disguising anything. In any case, it is financially better for me if it stays the same but I would like to see the country improve, and it actually has, every year since I first first visited in 1988 and then retired here a few years ago. This is just a discussion about how to jump start it to make things better for everybody.


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  4. hansie

    hansie DI Junior Member

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    If the Philippines would allow land ownership by foreigners and/or allow 51%+ ownership of companies by foreigners, the country would readily be gobbled up by Chinese and Koreans with little or no improvement for the local population.
     
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  5. djfinn6230

    djfinn6230 DI Senior Member

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    Agree that Filipinos are concerned that no land would be left for Filipinos, thus the constitutional prohibition. But I could buy land in Luxembourg, England or any of a number of wealthy, small countries if I could afford it; market values come into play and stabilize things. But I understand their concerns. Too bad it holds back development so much. Same issues in Thailand.


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  6. Jens K

    Jens K DI Forum Adept

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    you answered that right there yourself - in Europe or any other first world place you are an equal when competing with the locals in the land market. but here, opening up the market for foreign investment would be entirely unfair to the locals because they, with very few exceptions, are not at all able to bid over what any chinese, korean, european or american is able to pay.

    Markets don't always produce fair results, in fact this is so by definition. Therefore, such things have to be regulated.
     
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  7. djfinn6230

    djfinn6230 DI Senior Member

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    The rich Filipinos here own most of the land and they know how to deal with the markets and make their own investments in land. Some of the poor own smaller parcels of land that has been subdivided through inheritance and is often untitled. The poor could choose to sell at presumably a high profit like winning the lottery but then again they have to buy another place because they have to live somewhere. The rich would sell at whatever the market would bear, mostly for commercial and agricultural land (which would likely be put to more efficient use) but many owners would hold off selling in a growing sellers market. Free market might not be as bad as you think when you consider who owns the land now. If I were Chinese or Korean, I would probably like to remain in my own country and have a vacation spot but it is not clear that a massive number of them would actually do that. Perhaps a tiny few would want to immigrate and stay here year round. Very few Americans relative to the 110M population here would buy and live here forever and the way things are now, fewer would bother to invest in PI real estate. The only US market is people with Filipino spouses that want to live here and not the richer homeland.


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  8. Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    Even a small percentage of 1 billion people would overrun the local population. The second a person made a peso of profit the numbers desiring to come would jump significantly.
     
  9. grandpainak

    grandpainak DI Senior Member Showcase Reviewer Veteran Army

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    That is for sure. The rent for a 3 bedroom apartment in Alaska right now is more than one thousand dollars higher that my annual property tax here. Go figure.:cat:
     
  10. ChMacQueen

    ChMacQueen DI Forum Patron Highly Rated Poster Showcase Reviewer Veteran Army

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    While true that most foreigners are basically poor in their home countries I'll disagree with you. The reasoning is every dollar/peso a foreigner contributes to the economy has far greater weight for the country then the same amount contributed by a local. The reason is foreigners like OFWs are bringing in wealth from outside the Philippines which enriches the countries wealth exponentially. While there is no direct measurement one could still say one of my peso's that came from my US pension is worth 100 local peso's to the economy. Its simply that the locally economy can keep circulating on what it already has but it won't really grow because while one person may get richer another gets poorer maintaining a status quo. Bringing in outside money breaks that status quo and allows everyone that money circulates through to grow wealthier to some extent (except the originating country of course)

    As far as land ownership to foreigners that is a very tricky situation. We do NOT want to make it possible for the Philippines or even a significant part of the Philippines to become foreign owned as the locals could end up being a foreigner in their own country in a way. However their is an argument to allow foreigners to own land in their name as well for minor purposes but how to manage this?

    Now how to accomplish foreigners owning land even smaller amounts like 500sqm for residential purposes only? Any ways it goes there should be a way for the land to become owned again by the local government at a point be it when the foreigner dies w/o a local family member to inherit or doesn't meet certain residential requirements there anymore such as being absent for 1 or 2 years.

    Now my suggestions:

    1. Allow foreigners to become citizens with all of the same rights as a natural born Filipino citizen (besides President). Set conditions of course but said conditions should be somewhat lengthy but not ridiculously expensive. This would give the eventual ability for a foreigner to own land and a business. Maybe condition can only be met if married a Filipina and lived here for 5 years or whatever. However though a reasonable option should be there. It allows foreigners to have more skin in the game as well as rights.

    2. Filipino's HATE taking advice from foreigners and we can understand this at times. However the truth is many of us have seen far more of the world as well as options for things that many locals even local government will ever see. As such I'd allow and actually have the governor and mayors put together a special sort of townhall or some sort of debate and suggestion structure to allow and look for suggestions from foreign nationals on how to deal with some of the common issues our communities face. After are many of us are community members but give us a voice in a positive way and be willing to listen to suggestions some of us can offer numerous positive points of view on issues they haven't thought of. Allow us to participate in this way as well making proposals and suggestions with an actual debate field.

    3. Open a community public forum to mix foreigners and locals together and get us more connected. Plenty of Filipino's with some bright ideas out there and some foreigners as well. A community forum backed by the local government helping to put us together could do quite a bit. It could lead to new businesses as long as the foreigner feels protected on their investment as some Filipino's have bright ideas but no capital for even small things requiring only 20k peso's and a foreigner may be able to help as well as fine tune. It could lead to some sort of mixed group that helps out the poor community even. Many of us have done bits to help out the poor here and there even if just very local and I'm betting more of us would do more if we felt we could trust something and we do NOT trust things run by the government or a religious group but should it be local friends with a solid idea? Maybe. Anyways idea is to stop looking at us as foreigners and just brothers from another country and let us contribute and work with things.

    4. Decide who are the friends of Filipino's and the Philippines and who is the enemy. 10 years ago it felt like the country was solidly pro American and while a weak ally still a staunch US ally. Today it feels like the US and Americans are kind of trash here and its all about China and selling out to China. The Philippines needs to make up its mind to provide some solidity and trust.
     
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