Dumaguete Info Search


Salutations

Discussion in 'New Member Introductions' started by marc.oz, Feb 16, 2016.

  1. robert k

    robert k DI Forum Patron Highly Rated Poster Veteran Army

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    I will give you a leg up. Foreigners may not own land in the Philippines. It is the Law. The law also states that any attempt to get around or evade the law is illegal. Anything which goes against the intent of the law is illegal. That pretty much closes the loopholes.
    Many people have bright ideas, but how are you going to beat the law when anything you do to own land is illegal? You can own a condo in a building that is at least 60% Filipino owned because you don't actually own any land, the corporation owns the land. You could incorporate and buy a place I suppose but since you can own a maximum of 40%, you just granted others 60% (thank you!) and what do you do if they want THEIR money? It's theirs, you gave it to them. You could refuse to sell and they can bring a partition suit because your refusal to sell denies them their natural rights to the property and a judge will order the sale.

    The best one I have heard is the land will be in the wife's name and the Foreigner will lease from the wife. I think that if that lease was challenged by the wife in court, it wouldn't stand.

    In any contract language can be declared surplusage, which means it has no meaning, it is just filler. There is no need to lease marital property from one's wife and I believe the entire contract would be declared void on that basis. Part two is a contract must serve some purpose or it is void on the face of it. A contract is an agreement in the exchange of value. What do you gain by leasing from your spouse? This is not to say that a lawyer will not draw up a contract to say absolutely anything you want it to say.

    If I really wanted to try to own some dirt, I would try naturalization. There is a lengthy residency requirement and you need to learn a language I believe other than English. Still if you had children who were foreigners themselves they could inherit if you died without a will but it is against the law to will land to a foreigner, they can only inherit if you die intestate. The 50% compulsory heirs (unless you had a Filipino national child) would put them over the 40% ownership limit but the court would give them a reasonable time to sell. Has anyone mentioned that the Philippines doesn't want a foreigner to own land?

    You might also want to look into the perils of title, inheritance as it bears on title and taxes. Land title is a mess in the Philippines because there is compulsory heirs for 50% of any estate. The rest can be willed.

    Grandpa had clear title (1950) and 6 kids and died intestate. The second 50% is divided by the secondary heirs , wife, illegitimate children and the legitimate children get to double dip n the non-compulsory pool. Mom inherited 1/8 and remarried. To keep it simple, mom stopped having kids. When Mom passed her husband inherited 1/8 of mom's share and Mom's natural children inherited divided what was left. The six kids went on to marry and have 6 kids each and when they passed their 36 legitimate children inherited. There may be a few spouses, aunts, and so forth but they are superfluous to the point which I will get to shortly. The 36 kids averaged about 5 kids each. We are up to about 180 heirs for one piece of land that doesn't have updated title. Who do you buy it from? What if some don't want to sell? I think those who do want to sell will conveniently forget to mention the ones that don't. Don't worry though, you will be hearing from them in the future. They are actually your Co-tenants in the land with rights to use all and any part of it, albeit not exclusive right. Howdy neighbor! THERE IS NO TITLE INSURANCE IN THE PHILIPPINES.
     
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  2. Jack Peterson

    Jack Peterson DI Forum Luminary Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Air Force

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    robert k marc.oz
    Robert, Marc, Just to Clarify, a Foreigner may Not Lease land from a legal Wife but may Lease from a Girlfriend. However, should they marry it could and I say could give rise to a problem at a later stage:wink:

    Just so we are not giving dubious Info my friends.
     
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  3. robert k

    robert k DI Forum Patron Highly Rated Poster Veteran Army

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    True Jack. The point of my lengthy post is that there are so many pitfalls, it would be tough to avoid absolutely all of them. Not all of the troubles come from marital trouble either, happily married couple could find themselves in a pickle.

    I know there is no title insurance and since I am already a believer, I have not looked into if one could bring a quiet title suit in court in which one could give notice in a specified manner and anyone with a claim could be heard and provide evidence of their claim. Once a quiet title proceeding is finished generally title is brand new, like the title had never been granted before and past claims would be barred. I think it should exist in Philippine law but I can't swear to it.
     
  4. Jack Peterson

    Jack Peterson DI Forum Luminary Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Air Force

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    It most certainly should be concrete but until this Inheritance nonsense is sorted, nothing is safe. Fortunately the Title Law has tightened up quite a lot in that:
    On "A's" death ( God Forbid or anything else) I will become the sole Owner until my death, I can't sell the Land but may live their For as long as I wish, Our Daughter will Inherit on My death but that is where the problem may Arise, This very Obscure Inheritance law may yeald something we non of us knew but it is Something we are dealing with Now.
    When (TM) is 18 next Year the whole thing will have been sorted out (One Hopes) But...................:pompus:
     
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  5. Rye83

    Rye83 with pastrami Secured Account Highly Rated Poster SC Connoisseur Veteran Army

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    Great post! Every foreigner that comes into this country should be forced to read that.

    The only thing you are doing when buying land is making a donation to a local or volunteering for a massive headache. If you aren't ok with that then don't do it, it will never be yours.
     
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  6. charlyB

    charlyB DI Member

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    DON'T DO IT !
    There has been lots of legal advice from other forum members on the pro's & con's of property ownership but something not mentioned yet are neighbours, unfortunately neighbours are like a$$holes and we all have to have them, unless you are very lucky you will have neighbours that, block the access road with their cars, motorbikes funeral wake card tables or anything else, have loud karaoke and none of them can hold a note, let their dogs run wild and crap all over, have shouting competitions when they are only 2 feet apart and never seem to work so they are always staring at you as you go by.
    So my advice / opinion is to rent as it is so much easier to move on and start again but if you really want to buy then go for the largest piece of land you can afford and put the house right in the middle so you are as far away from them as possible.
     
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  7. OP
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    marc.oz

    marc.oz DI Junior Member

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    I don't know.
    Thanks everyone for enlightening me, although I seem to have opened a can worms!

    I understand now the reluctance to make a financial commitment in real estate. However, it'd be interesting to see statistics of how many property deals have really gone bad for foreigners.

    After reading your answers I did a little research and I found and interesting blog which tries to answer the question; Can foreigners own land and other real properties in the Philippines? There are a couple of interesting examples of the Supreme Court decision of the Elena Buenaventura Muller vs. Helmut Muller and the Borromeo vs. Descallar cases.

    Legal Updates and free legal information Family Code Philippines: Property rights of foreigners married to or living in with Filipino citizens; Can foreigners own land and other real properties in the Philippines?

    In any case now that I have this info, it seems to me that renting is the ONLY way to go.

    Cheers
     
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  8. robert k

    robert k DI Forum Patron Highly Rated Poster Veteran Army

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    I learned something very important in that link. Don't play poker with that Austrian guy. Did you note that Borreo-whatever had to go all the way to the supreme court? To get property he only paid 250k php for sure...but the legal fees! Was it worth it? Did the Austrian truly get his money back at less than 1/3 of the value? There was only one clear cut winner....the lawyer of Borreo-whatever.
     
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  9. AlwaysRt

    AlwaysRt DI Forum Patron Highly Rated Poster Blood Donor Veteran Air Force Marines

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    Has anyone looked into owning property in a corporation? You hold 40% ownership in Class 'A' voting shares and "they" (wife, GF etc) holds 60% ownership in Class 'B' non-voting shares. They legitimately own 60% but you have control. Upon divorce, breakup, death, the 60% can be distributed whatever way, you still have control. Or would this be considered "circumventing the intent of the law" and be disallowed?
     
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  10. Dave_Hounddriver

    Dave_Hounddriver DI Forum Patron Highly Rated Poster

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    It would be considered circumventing the law IF you break up with your wife and she goes to a lawyer and says the only reason for the company owning the property is to get around the law AND if the judge is convinced of that.
     
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