⌛ Top 10 in the World? In Dreamworld!

I am not a diver, but would like to put my 2 pence here. Extracting the highlights of the kid of Zambesi’s messages , without any doubt could sense some expression of anger and distaste ( I agree with how some posters see his tone here) trying to express some challenge something based from his little golden diving expedition from only a ‘ few oceans ’ against the recently high subject of improtance marine diversity of the Philippines describing it as over rated ?While diving in Apo …he probably was led to dive into the wrong side of the island ,where fishing is allowed , as Melvin Tinklehopper suspect ,might eb right ,lols . A ‘well thought’ reflection and comparison by Zambisi .;-P and drawing strong conclusions and try to win his argument by posting links of his old readings of Raja Ampat of Indonesia , oh well that was something of 2002 as dated. Expeditions discoveries doesn’t end that year of 2002 mate ,it continues on .The claims over the richness of marine diversity of philipines wasn’ t from wacko divers and profiteering divesites around but from various authoritative sources , groups of scientist from reknown world institutions not just one single source . The findings of the Philippines was relatively recent in time chronology than the Raja Ampat of 2002 . One French led marine expedition (backed up by the French National Museum of Natural history ) led by 100 scientist world wide ( not just filipinos ) and was done in Panglao,Bohol in 2004-2005 ,published in 2006, and a separate expedition of same year Lead by another group (Dominion university ,Smithsonian institution ,National Geographic ) and so forth to this year with other independent marine expeditions supporting similar claims.Perhaps in the coming years findings will change and getting updated with what's the latest doesn't take long to find.

UnderwaterTimes | Scientists: New Species Found In Philippines Waters; 'It's Going Back To The Source'

UnderwaterTimes | Philippines President Enacts New Conservation Policy to Protect Southeast Asia's 'Coral Triangle'


New Mollusk Species Found in Philippines - washingtonpost.com

If this kid had made the equivalent of 2000 dives or more around Philippine waters or have more weighty institutional academic grounds like research as back up support with his claims ,then his opinion perhaps will bear more weight to consider.I appreciate more objective opinions , not hulabaloos . But I suppose majority of divers only look into the underwater macro life and for this kid is only base on his personal experience subjective to his satisfaction, can’t argue with that .

In addition ,it’s blaring true Philippines still a third world country , sewage and rubbish disposal as the main hurdle to conservation and no one denies the fact that this is a big issue to environmentalists. Legislations were passed but the question about implementation and how far these legislations will go is still daunting .I thought Zambisi knew this before he visits this country, can’t expect technically clean surroundings like the west or those touristic destinations he’s been .This isn’t to defend Apo island because there is some truth with it .
The Philippines is only new in the tourism pathway and that’s the fact it is less comparable to other mature and organize tourism destination in southeast asia like thailand.
But just for the fact that he loves to whinge and say over some political correctness and passion of environmental conservation along with criticisms about how people disregard the environment and stockpiles of rubbish and many people inhabiting apo , but blatantly forgetting that even himself is contributing to a lot to it . Speaking of his travel routes and activities around including diving experiences all over (airline and all modes of transportation to get from one place to another leave carbon footprints that is contributing to global degradation, is more than the comparison to the rubbish in apo island.It’s pointing another person’s speck in the eye but haven’t removed the log in his own eye ,and saying ‘do as I said , don’t do what I do’ .

If you have strong passion to contribute to environmental conservation in this world Zambezi kid, better stay at home ,avoid travel and put your acts together boy.

 

Some group of scientist do distance their arguements from blaming entirely human activities as main cause global degradation and warming , some accounts pin points to natural changes in global climatic patterns that trace back to millions of years cycle .The philippines alone doesn't bring weight so much to world climatic changes,but look at us we love travel,do holidays abroad,nice meals (fruits,veges ,meat ) transported even as far from the remotest places of the world only to answer our whims and demands ,nice clothes ,underwears ,coats and big bulk manufactured in China fueled its new industrial revolution which puffs more CO2's even surpassing the US, doesn't give justice to criticize one speck of the disorganized philippines.

I see it differently tim8ter , can't see any downhill aspect in this thread. When the thread starts with controversial issues, there's underlying stimulation created for people to post various opinions ,what they think,what they feel ,even some humour ,sarcastic and silly comments ,quite a mixture and so forth only seen as evidence that people are different, the variety ,it's like art as i see it , i enjoy it though . Again my 2 pence .

 

Newt:
I'm not defending the Kid and I have no problem with controversial threads but I find it difficult to justify name-calling in a discussion. It shows the inablility to formulate a coherent argument.
Prog:
You've said it very well and I appreciate your frustration.
I see a lot of people engaging in activities that are very frustrating to me but unless I favor tyrannical government over personal freedom I have to show some tolerance. As a result, I can only exercise my rights as a citizen in my own country, support groups that promote agendas I agree in and change my own behavior. Each of us can make a difference but we must start with ourselves. Hopefully others will "catch on". Now, if I were "King of the World".......

 

Hi tim, i agree there are also rubbish or name calling,oh well , i ignore them pick only the better ones.

 

My man Gass, I'm going to call you the Iron Chef, cause you slice em' and dice em' and chop em' into little bite size pieces!

:D Hahahahahahaha!

 

Oh Earl, what am I to do with you?

I was clearly being sarcastic in my previous post because it is very obvious from your posts that you have no respect for me.

All I have asked from you all along is some evidence to support your fantastical claims. Surely that is not too much to ask? The best you could come up with was a TextMate website (WTF?) and a quoted figure that was actually less than the numbers I had given you for just one proposed park in Indonesia (not the whole country).

Well, I am always here if you can find some better evidence; but I suspect you can't - firstly, because you claim is not true and therefore no such evidence exists; and secondly, because you sound like a typical crazy scientist that can't support any claims!

As Talking Heads say in Psychokiller "You're talking a lot but you're not saying anything". You seem so intent on displaying your scientific knowledge to the audience that you ignore the purpose of the thread and what others are writing. You're so engrossed in trying to display your worth that you don't actually say anything except a heap of irrelevant statements (pictures of fish from Japan, strong currents in Apari... WTF?)

Sorry to be so blunt Earl, but as you said, you don't respect me, so why should I continue to give you any regard? You seem to treat all communications as a direct threat to your esteem and as a competition. But that's not what it's about at all. So can I suggest before you babble on incessantly about irreverant information in the future, you just take a moment to pause and consider how that information will be received by the reader.

 

Hi Pickled Newt (and Timn8ter) – I’d just like to address some of the issues you raise above:

Thanks for the research links – I’ll have a read of those later today.

You seem to be assuming so much of me from manufacturing a life story for me. I haven’t done any ‘golden diving expeditions’ in the west. I am from Africa, and have done all my diving in Africa and in Asia and the Pacific – all third/second world countries just like the Philippines.

For what it’s worth, I dived Cogon, Chapel, Coconuts, Rock Point East and West. I stated at the start that I have made only 8 dives there and my conclusions are based on my experience from that.

Forums are for expressing opinions, I expressed my opinion of Apo, and I’ve expressed my opinion of what I’d suggest could be done about the situation, which was all positive (I hope). I didn’t resort to any ‘name calling’ – that seemed to be coming from Earl and Gass.

You might not agree with my opinion, and you’re quite entitled to your own opinions too. But, all I ask is for you (and others) to support your opinions.

Timn8ter suggests that we can only change things within our own country. I’d say that is a little defeatist, it’s like washing your hands of all the stuff you don’t like that goes on in other places. There are lots of international and overseas agencies and groups that do enormously valuable work in making significant changes overseas.

It is true that change must start with one’s self. I give generously to conservation bodies, I am an animal rights advocate and an active vegan. I also author various conservation orientated articles. I believe that if you ‘talk-the talk’ you must first ‘walk-the-walk’. I believe in marine conservation – I don’t believe that I can say that with any level of sincerity whilst eating fish and seafood, so I don’t. I believe life is just as precious to its holder, whether it be a fish, a cow or a child, hence I don’t kill animals and I believe in preserving areas of land and sea for the other creatures of this earth; it is not all mankind’s to do what it wishes with, other animals deserve their share of the earth too.

But I’d like to take issue with a recurrent theme that seems to be expressed often – that of the carbon footprint. I have two issues with this:

1. To raise this subject is to deflect attention form the issues that are being discussed. It is irrelevant to what’s happening on the ground here – it’s just throwing in another argument to deflect criticism.
2. Let’s take an example of a plane load of tourists that go on holiday, say, from Europe to the Red Sea. They all fly on one plane and then stay in the same resort for two weeks. Can someone pls tell me how the fuel bill for that trip exceeds the fuel bill if they had all stayed at home and worked – two hundred cars driving to work and back ten times, two hundred houses being heated and lights burnt – the arithmetic doesn’t make sense to me – I suspect this notion of a carbon footprint is a badly thought through scare-mongering tactic used to press through party agendas.

I’d be interested to hear anyone else’s thoughts on that.

As for Gass – well, he was obviously just let out of hospital today, so I’ll excuse him for his outburst. But, the reason that the fish populations are being decimated here is not from foreign demand – if you believe that then you are naïve – just think for a moment about when fish populations stared to collapse – way before tourists arrived here in numbers. Fish stocks collapse because the Philippines population has grown from 8-9 million to 95 million in less than 100 years. And that’s down to religion. I can’t think of any other country with such a staggering population growth rate.

I hope this post clarifies a few issues for people and I would be interested to continue a serious debate with anyone that cares about these issues, not petty point scoring and mud-slinging.

 

Hi Jellyfish, thanks for your support - it is appreciated

The four areas i was referring to are Menjangan (walls) /Pemuteran (fringe reef and artificial reef project) /Gilimanuk (muck diving) in the north west, Tulamben (wall, pinnacles, macro and wreck), Padang Bay (rocky islets, currents, pelagics) and Lembongan Island/Nusa Penida - supposedly has the strongest oceanic currents in the world (I suppose several places lay claim to that!) - but is great for drift diving, deep and fringe reefs. Mantas and sunfish of course are the big attraction there. Lembongan is nice for me cos it is so unlike the rest of Bali - very peaceful, no traffic - like a holiday should be!

So, when you add all these four places together, it makes a good and varied dive holiday programme.

 

Dude, Gass just ate your lunch, and you're so full of yourself you didn't even realize it.

Hahahahaha!

 

You are gonna ban me from the forum because I don't agree with you on something?! What kind of a response is that?

How can one learn if not by listening to others opinions?